It might sound unbelievable, but the same skaters who once dominated the streets, grinding rails and launching off hubbas in iconic videos like Welcome to Hell and Mouse, are now catching waves. The crossover between skateboarding and surfing, two seemingly distinct board sports, has become increasingly prominent. While skateboarding emerged from surfing, the street-focused skate scene of the ’90s seemed worlds apart from the laid-back beach culture. Fast forward to today, and the lines have blurred, with surfers adopting skateboarding tricks and skaters embracing the surfer lifestyle. Even some of the most legendary names in skateboarding have discovered the allure of the ocean.
Chico Brenes, Rob Welsh, Elissa Steamer, and Max Schaaf, four skaters who also surf, in a collage.
We spoke with four skate icons – Chico Brenes, Rob Welsh, Elissa Steamer, and Max Schaaf – to learn about their experiences transitioning from concrete to the waves. Despite their natural talent on a skateboard, they quickly realized that surfing presented a whole new set of challenges. They shared their stories about the humbling experience of learning to surf and how it has impacted their skateboarding.
Close up shot of a surfboard in the sand with a small wave in the background.
Chico Brenes
How did your journey into surfing begin?
Initially, my surf attempts were limited to trips to Nicaragua a couple of times a year, sticking close to the shore. I had a personal rule: if I couldn’t touch the bottom, I wouldn’t go out. But a good friend from Potrero Park, a seasoned surfer who even tackled Mavericks back in the day, kept encouraging me to try it. He would invite me to borrow gear from the NorCal shop, offering wetsuits and boards. One sweltering day, when the city hit 105 degrees, I decided to take him up on the offer.
Soon, I was visiting the shop daily to get a board, completely oblivious to the nuances of surfing – tides, swells, everything. I got thrashed, but I was hooked. As more of my skate buddies got into surfing, I felt the need to keep up. I don’t like being bad at anything! So I was out there every day. I never realized how challenging it was; I had thought it couldn’t be that hard. I mean, I’d dropped into vert ramps and all, but…
But surfing a wave is not the same as dropping into a ramp…
Exactly! It took me about eight months to build up my arm strength and another year to understand how to read the waves. Now, I can tell when to pull back, when to go for it, and I understand surf etiquette.
How is surf etiquette different from skate etiquette?
You don’t want to drop in on someone and get run over. I had to learn that the hard way, getting yelled at by other surfers. There is nothing like that in skateboarding, maybe the closest thing is taking turns on a mini ramp. I’ve witnessed a lot of fights in the water. But the more you surf at the same spot, the more people you get to know. Skateboarding used to be a little like that too, like at Embarcadero.
Chico Brenes pictured from the shoulders up, with a beard and backwards hat, smiling slightly in front of a sunny backdrop.
How has surfing impacted your skateboarding?
I feel stronger and more relaxed overall. Every time I get out of the water, I feel great. It’s like, “Okay, what’s next? Let’s go skate. Let’s do whatever!”
Surfers will use different boards for different conditions. You also have a variety of skateboard setups, including some retro ones. Is there a connection between these two things?
Absolutely. As I’ve gotten older, I started to get bored with the popsicle shape. I knew I wasn’t going to be learning many new tech tricks. I’ve got my tricks down, and I want to keep them as long as I can, but riding the retro boards has reignited my stoke. It’s actually possible to do modern tricks on those older shapes. As for surfboards, I currently have a mid-length board shaped by Travis Reynolds, with artwork by Thomas Campbell, that I’m really stoked on.
Sometimes I wish I had started surfing sooner, but I never pictured myself being the guy waking up at dawn to catch the waves. When we were young, we’d wake up at noon to skate EMB and stay up late. I never thought I’d become that guy.
Is there anything else you’d like to say about the link between surfing and skateboarding?
I feel the same rush on a wave as I do on my skateboard, just dropping in and making a turn. If you can keep feeling that same stoke in your fifties or sixties, that’s a great thing. It’s harder to get that same feeling from skateboarding as you get older. I also love being in the ocean.
It’s something I can share with my daughter, and that’s the most amazing thing. Seeing her catch waves and ride them all the way to shore, it’s a reminder of what life is all about.
Elissa Steamer pictured from the shoulders up, wearing a black t-shirt, looking off to the side with a serious expression on her face.
Elissa Steamer
How did you get into surfing?
I always wanted to surf, but I never really took the time, because skateboarding was always enough. When I got sober, I made some friends who surfed. I admitted to them that I was scared of the ocean, despite living near a beach most of my life. They convinced me to get a wetsuit. With my friend Lucas, I went out that day, and got a sweet belly ride. That’s when I got hooked. I thought I’d be ripping in no time, but it’s been 12 years, and I’m still not ripping.
What was it like going from being a highly skilled skater to a beginner at something so difficult?
It gave me a new spark of something to think about at night, to dream about, to visualize, and work toward. It was great to have that feeling of “One of these days I’m going to be able to do this.”
Did age play a part in your interest in surfing?
It’s definitely less painful. I see older people skating, and I am one of them. But I also see 60- and 70-year-olds surfing. Once you get the hang of it and have the muscles, you can keep doing it. You might get hit by your board sometimes, but you’re not going to be smashing your shins and twisting your ankles every day.
Can you talk about the cultures of surfing and skateboarding? How are they similar or different?
They are different overall. Surfers want less people in the water, while skaters want more. You want the waves to yourself. While sometimes you might want a skate spot to be empty, usually the more people skating the better. With surfing, if I go to a crowded spot, I’m worried for my life. There are a lot of people with big longboards that don’t know what they’re doing. They don’t know how the ocean works, or to hold onto their boards, or to look behind them. So there are always boards flying, and it’s super dangerous. If I pull up to the beach and see a lot of people, that’s a deterrent. It’s a bummer.
But if I show up at a skate spot and see a crowd, sometimes it makes me want to skate harder. The other day I went to Embarcadero, and there were a lot of kids hanging out. I felt compelled to skate. I went and tried my hardest, threw myself down some stairs because I’m looking for praise and attention.
Elissa Steamer pops up on a surfboard mid-wave.
Has surfing changed the way you skate?
Maybe I’ve gotten worse at skating because I don’t do it as much. With skating, if you’re not comfortable, it’s scary, and it’s not fun when it’s scary. It can take me a couple of days to feel comfortable enough to try something. But with surfing, as soon as you pop up, it’s more comfortable.
I remember an interview where you talked about how you used to just skate ledges and do flip tricks. In your recent parts, you’ve been doing bert slides on banks and skating transition in a groovy way.
Yeah, I think that comes with age. If you keep skating ledges, you’re going to end up at some stairs! When you skate banks, you try to get groovy. But it used to be that skating came from surfing, and now it’s the other way around.
Are people trying kickflips and other skate tricks on surfboards?
Yeah, and airs. They’re grabbing their boards the way skaters grab theirs. They’re going really fast and digging into their rail to turn, which is like a powerslide. The more commotion you can make on the wave, the better, and I think that’s a skate influence.
Elissa Steamer wearing a "Gnarhunters" t-shirt, skating a bank.
Can you talk about Gnarhunters’ surf influence? Gnarhunters is very playful, while surfing can sometimes take itself too seriously.
Gnarhunters is my little project. It began as a way to poke fun at surfing through skateboarding, or skateboarding’s version of surfing. I think there’s a lot about surfing that’s funny, and that’s what some of the Gnarhunters videos are about.
It’s funny because surfers are all in the water together, it’s like… I can see what you look like naked. I can see your body shape. It’s very vulnerable. Is that why surfers are so aggressive? Because they feel vulnerable?
Is there anything that should change about surf culture?
Sometimes things get out of hand, people are jerks, or fights break out. But at the same time, I think localism is a necessary evil. Respect needs to go both ways: from the locals and from the visitors. A lack of respect is what causes most of the problems. I’ve had people threaten to kill me in the water. I’ve had people hit my board.
I kind of like it for its quirks. I wouldn’t change anything. It makes for great stories.
People don’t often talk about skateboarding as a spiritual experience, but surfing does have that aspect.
Surfing is more peaceful. You’re on a nice beach, with the sun shining, birds, and waves. But skateboarding, you’re in the gutter downtown with some tweaker, falling over next to needles. Both have this mindlessness where you are just getting all your energy out. They’re helpful in the same way. If I’m having a rough time I’ll go bomb some hills for a bit, and I’ll feel better. Or I’ll wake up angry and go surf, and maybe I’ll feel better, or maybe I won’t.
Max Schaaf, pictured from the shoulders up, with his head turned slightly to the side, sporting a beard and backwards hat, with a serious expression.
Max Schaaf
How’s it going out there? How’s the surf been?
It’s a windy day in Northern California. I’ve been surfing a little less since COVID. At first I felt guilty. Also, I realized how obsessive I was becoming. I would drive to Pacifica, which is 45 minutes away, and then to another spot an hour and twenty minutes away, all in the same day. I think I became addicted to it. I was not getting anything done at the shop.
How did you get into surfing?
I painted a motorcycle for some surfer dudes, and I said, “Instead of paying me $1,000 for the paint job, how about you give me a really nice board?” I put it in the corner of my motorcycle shop and painted fish scales on it. For my 42nd birthday, I decided to go surfing for two months, at least once a week. I paddled out and was completely clueless. I didn’t go with anyone in the beginning.
A couple of older guys recognized me, saying, “Hey man, you skate, right?” They’d be like, “Oops, you dropped in on that guy,” or, “Try leaning forward a little,” giving me small tips. I think they felt self-conscious about telling a skateboarder what to do.
The first few months were brutal. A couple of times, I punched my steering wheel hard with tears in my eyes, asking myself, “Why can’t I do this?” I didn’t understand why I was always on top of the wave as it was crashing, slamming me into the whitewater. I would be up at 3 AM, staring at the ceiling, wondering if I just wasn’t meant to surf. That learning curve was extremely hard. But once it clicked… I remember the day it happened, and my feet were really close together, and I was on the right wave, going so fast.
What is the connection between surfing and skating for you?
People told me that it would mess up my skating. I don’t know if they thought I’d widen my stance or stop doing ollies into backside airs and start floating them. I never noticed that happening. I think it helped me. It was a nice break from overthinking skating in my forties. People have asked me if I think a surfer who skates has better style. I actually think most surfers skate kind of weird, but I do think skaters have better style surfing.
I’ve reached a point in surfing where I can take time off and come back feeling pretty strong. But if I don’t skate vert for months, I usually slam the first session. When I’m doing a blunt to fakie, I’m like, “Oh no, this is terrifying.”
Max Schaaf surfing, pictured from the waist up, mid-turn.
Can you explain different styles of surfing and how they relate to skating?
It’s very much a skater mindset to be divided about styles in skating, especially back in the day. We would say, “I only skate elliptical ramps,” or “I only skate Pier 7 with this size jeans and this size wheels and two bolts on each truck.” It was silly.
I didn’t want to shred with a stomp pad. When I saw the Huntington hop, I thought, “I don’t want to do that.” It just looks goofy and unnecessary. As a skater, when you see someone s-turning down the street on a Sector-9, you’re like, “That’s not the kind of skateboarding I want to do.”
I discovered Greg Liddle and his designs by googling the logo on my surfboard that I’d gotten from the shop, and I thought, “That’s exactly how I want to surf.” I want to trim and glide. My friend Barry [McGee] is the embodiment of that. I’ve seen him at Pacifica, where the wall is blocking the wave, and he looks like he’s floating across the top of the wall with no effort, and I think that’s so “skating.”
Max Schaaf gliding across the face of a wave.
Was it relieving to not have to impress when surfing?
Being anonymous was the best part. There’s a skatepark down the street, and when I go there, I hope no one recognizes me. Then someone will say, “Max! What’s up, dude?! Tailslide that thing and ollie out!”
I can still skate, but some days, I get out of the car and primo a kickflip, it hurts, and the session is over. So, being able to go out there and, even if I pearl, no one is going to think, “That dude pearls and he’s ‘somebody’”…That part was amazing. Now that I’m not a beginner, people can’t tell I’m just another guy out there so I’m even more anonymous.
Every subculture has its rules, from motorcycling to skating and surfing. What’s your take on that?
I remember Eric Koston looking at my skateboard once and being like, “You ride Phillips head bolts?” I was like, “Yeah.” He and six other people in the van were like, “No Phillips head. Only Allen.” I thought they were high! The dudes I surf with are like, “Don’t wear a leash!” But this winter, I would wake up at 4 AM, be the first one out there, and if it was overhead, I’d use a leash, because I’d gotten a couple of tubes, and it was too dangerous. If someone said, “Hey man, I think vert is wack,” I’d ask, “Really? How good are you at it?” If they’re like, “Well I’ve never even dropped in,” I’d say “Then shut the fuck up.”
I’ve tried the Huntington hop to see how it feels. I’ve tried a frontside air on my fish, and I ended up flying through the air upside down. I don’t like it when people hack the lip, but I’m going to try it before I say it’s wack.
I’ve stopped caring what people think, and I’m doing my own thing. There’s this clip that people keep sending me of a dude doing a finger flip on a surfboard. It’s just so wrong. There’s no soul in it. I think with surfing—this is going to sound cheesy—but there is a soul to it. I think the rules come from a place of taste and time spent doing it.
Anything else you’d like to say about surfing and skating?
Anything I love, including the woman that I’m with, has found me at the right time in my life, whether it was motorcycles, surfing, or skating. I really needed skating when I was a kid. I was extremely lonely and lost. With surfing, I had just gone through a divorce. I really needed that at that time. I could have easily fallen into the bar scene and drank myself to death. Something about that moment aligned for me beautifully, and I’m very grateful for it. I find waking up in the ocean extremely appealing. I’m grateful for anything in this digital age that allows us to slow down, appreciate where we live more, and ground ourselves.
Rob Welsh, pictured from the waist up, holding a surfboard, with a sunny backdrop behind him.
Rob Welsh
How did you first get into surfing?
I was 15, living in Maine, and I tried it a few times. But I was working a lot and saving money to move to San Francisco, so I didn’t do much of it. I also loved skating so much, and it was my priority. I didn’t think much about surfing again until I hurt my knee in 2003 and was like, “I need to do something.” Now, I love it.
About six months after my knee injury, I started going out at Ocean Beach and getting destroyed. I would just try to make it out into the lineup and keep going every day. When you’re a beginner, you don’t know where to go or when to go. It took me a while to figure out where I needed to be in the lineup and then build the strength to get there. It can be discouraging for people if they’re not getting it right away.
What was it like being so skilled at skateboarding and then basically starting from scratch with surfing?
I say this all the time: If I could start skateboarding from zero again, that would be great. Remember how fun it was to learn to skateboard? It’s painful but exciting. It was the best thing ever. So with surfing, not knowing how to do it was an opportunity to learn how to skateboard again. You’re starting from scratch pretty much and the skatepark is moving! It’s just great, and I think everyone who skates owes it to themselves to try it. If you don’t love it, something is wrong with you. It’s life-altering. I joke that my dream is to play in a Thursday night cover band on some surf island and then surf all week.
Do you skate differently now that you surf?
Not really. I would say that I think about surfing through a skate lens. I think floaters look cool to me. They’re like a 50-50. Some turns look like a frontside rock. Backside hacks are like a backside tailslide. When someone is throwing their tail, it’s like a backside disaster that’s throwing water. I always see it as skating.
Rob Welsh rides a wave, pictured mid-turn, with a slightly cloudy sky overhead.
How do you rate yourself as a surfer compared to a skater?
I’m not a great surfer or even a good surfer. It’s the same as skating; you have to put in the work to be good. Those years that I would’ve been doing that, I put into skating. I’m only as good as the wave is. I have a hard time sitting back and letting the wave do its thing. I feel like I need to go somewhere. I’m trying to pump it or something to get speed. And you’re only riding for two seconds sometimes.
When you’re a pro skater, your skating is tied to your identity. You want your skating to be good. Is it appealing to have surfing be something it’s okay to not be good at?
No one in the water knows I’m a skater. I’m just another bare bum in the shower. There’s nothing awesome about being an old skateboarder. Physically, it hurts, and you’re like, “I know I’m skating like shit.” But now with skating and with surfing, I go and do what I do, and I have fun, and that’s all I’m trying to get out of it. It’s all for enjoyment. The other stuff, selling products and all that, is a different story. It’s the act that’s important.
Words by: Matt L Roar
Matt L. Roar is the author of, My War, a hybrid novel about growing up skating in the Bay Area in the 90s, forthcoming from Spork Press in 2021.
Share this with a beach bum on Facebook
Report this as fried on Instagram and Twitter
